another sniper attack

I'm moving to Holland!

...then again, maybe the government doesn't want to ban guns for the extremely old and simple cause; money?

I know it sounds like a cliché and kinda childish, but if you really go back to basics:

Guns cost money, and everyone's buying them..why the hell make an end to that? Maybe even the government of the USA has a beanCounter that makes estimates of human casualties caused by weapons, and then they sit down and say "yeah well, that estimate we can live with, after all, it pays off pretty darn nice! Muhahahah!!!" and smoke cigarrs. ?

Ok, a bit over done it there, but you get my point. It's kind of obviouse, or is it?

Originally posted by Ellery Sneed
Why do so many people go nuts over the right to have a gun? I think the NRA people are all nuts. When columbine happened they all came out in full force, sickos!!!

Michael Moore is great (check out "Bowling for Columbine"!), I wish more Americans thought like him. It's time to get out of this 1800's mentality. The reason things are screwed up and people are dying is cause any wacko can get a gun here!!! I don't have anything against guns if used for hunting 'animals' or at the range or some **** like that, but hell... anyone who has a criminal record should absolutely be denied the right to own one and that's all I got to say about that!

Overall guns generally suck and Charlton Heston is lame :p

Michael Moore is an extreme liberal asshole with biased liberal views. If anyone cannot see through that they are the ones who need a wake up call.

Dan hit it on the head. States/Cities with the "right to carry" laws have violent crime rates nearly drop off completely.

You want to catch the sniper. Give every "LAW OBIDING" citizen a gun to carry around for a week or so. Then if he tries anything, it will be the last thing he/she/they ever do. Instant justice for a piece of crap coward loser who should have their sack ripped off very slowly.

They did exactly that in Australia, pank. Crime lowered significantly cause everybody was packing heat.

Originally posted by sidez
I'm just glad firearms can't be bought legally here. You know its sad if they started to blame games and kids over this incident. I mean, a sniper takes years to train to shoot right. I don't think its some random kid who goes around shooting people for no reason.

sidez .....i think this is the first time im going to disagree with you.
You know its sad if they started to blame games and kids over this incident.
this is a major reason why there is so much violence in america.
some games are exceptable but some are just not a good role modle for a little kid that is very easy to brain wash.
the assholes that flew into the towers on 9-11 trained them selves to some extent by "Flight Simulator".
these games today are so realistic kids think its cool to kill inocent people and **** prostitutes (GTA). they might be nice because of the graphics but the hidden truth behind them are very wrong to be letting any person buy.
all the person has to do is buy a game that is semi realistic and get a general idea how to shoot then buy the gun and test in a forest and your ready to go on a shooting spree.
do others agree with me?
later o and powerfulsquid your football friend is a sicko

OK macho nachos -

here's the plan - give everyone a gun?

Then, buy everyone a horse, put a good ol' sherriff's badge on everyone, too, and then we'll all be safe. While we're at it, let's just turn back time 300 years.

While I love the diversity of this forum, it's absolutely impossible for us to talk politics. Admit it. I'm not from where you're from, and you aren't from here. I was at a club that got shot up by drive by shooters 2 weeks ago, interrupting a really good band, and 500 people's good time. Therefore, I'm sorry, I don't think guns provide safety, they provide primitive chaos and disorder.

Ok, so, what if I pack a gun to the concert next time I go? Will it stop anything? Hell no. I'd be delusional to think it would. Take the guns away from the bastards who drove by? Maybe that would help, though, huh?

Only through his NRA card-holding, cold, dead fingers, right? So be it.

How can you take them away? Criminals still get guns even if you make them illegal. That's why they're ****ing criminals.

Dude, from where I come from, kids are alot smarter than that, and most kids should anyways.

Dek, you should move here.. No guns, cept for the cops

Gguy: You're slightly off on your facts. The NRA doesn't spend all their time promoting legislation that allows mass production of military assault rifles, they spend most of their time fighting the anti-constitutional legislation (more laws) that all the bleeding heart liberals in Washington want to cram down Americas throat.

The solution is not legislation, it's education. You want less gun accidents (which, btw, are statistically very low), then teach kids to shoot target or sporting clays--teaching them gun safety and awareness. The result will be MUCH more effective at reducing gun accidents.

Are you all too young to remember the cold war. While there are very good debates against any weapons of mass destruction, the reality of their existance and the success of the cold war showed us that mutual destruction IS a deterent. The reasons for disarmament are because there is no 'moral' scenario that can justify the use of weapons of mass destruction--but there is no justification for taking away a man's right to defend himself or the moral imparitve to protect the innocent. Guns are not a weapon of "mass destruction", they are instruments of law enforcement and self defense. And I believe the but-twipe with the sniper rifle and the banger with the 9 don't want to die... and if they had to wonder if everyone around them was carrying or not, I think they'd rethink their methods.

holy crap... now you have to go and bring video games into this discussion.

"this is a major reason there is so much violence in america"? yeah right...

1. Games are no worse about graphic violence than movies. Have you seen movies like saving private ryan or that other new one with mel gibson? that's about as realistic as it gets, yet they are given tons of awards and heralded in the press for allowing everyone to relive how emotional and terrible the war was.

2. there is absolutely no similarity between operating a gun in a video game and operating a gun in real life. You don't use the same controls, you don't aim the same way, you don't have to hold a 20lb gun, you don't have to worry about it locking up, you don't have to deal with it kicking, blah blah blah. It's like saying kids are learning to shoot guns by using a remote control to watch a movie like saving private ryan where they shoot guns, or saying you can learn to ride a bike by watching an informercial about it. You don't see kids that play Tony Hawk's Pro Skater all the time going out and doing 900's on a 16 foot half pipe on their first try, do you?

3. every single video game that has come out in the past 5 years or so, has a rating on it. it tells parents exactly what kind of game it is, and what to expect. it even tells them the ages it is suitable for. just like movies. parents don't allow their kids to watch R rated movies, and they shouldn't allow them them to play teen and M rated games. it's up to the parent to monitor what kinds of games their kids are playing, not the government or retail stores.

4. retail stores don't always enforce the age limit for buying an M rated game, and they definitely should. that is one area that can definitely be improved on. they should check id just like they do when buying an R rated movie, or buying cigarettes. but the game manufacturers have done all they can to protect children from more mature oriented games. they put huge red warning stickers on the front saying to check id, and that this game is not suitable for minors. they put passwords in the game, so that a parent can lockout the more graphic effects of the game with a password so the kids won't be exposed to it, but can still play the game. and of course they put the ratings on every box.

5. why does wal-mart refuse to sell violent video games, but they freely sell R rated movies that depict much more realistic violence? Plus, they sell the guns that actually kill people! wal-mart sells more guns than any other company in the entire country, yet they won't sell a game that simulates shooting a gun? that makes a ton of sense.....

6. people need to take some responsibility for their own kids. i don't have any, but if i did, i wouldn't go blaming the video game industry for making violent games, or trying to stop the movie industry from making violent movies with cussing and sex in them. or blaming cigarette manufacturers for making cigarettes. i would talk to my kid and tell them what they can and can't watch, listen to, play, or do. and if they did it anyway, i would blame myself for not instructing them properly. not try to bring down an entire multi-billion dollar industry because i am too lazy to parent my own kids.

7. the media uses video games as the scape goat for everything. and obviously, many americans go right along with it and eat up every word. like those guys that went on a shooting spree in their school in germany. the media started saying that the cops found a copy of DOOM on their computers... what does that have to do with anything? nothing. even if it did, the game did not cause the kids to go out and shoot people, they were attracted to the game because they already had some major psychological issues. who knows, maybe the games even delayed their shooting spree by allowing them to vent their frustration and anger into a video game rather than their classmates and teachers?

8. i completely agree that kids are impressionable and easy to brain wash, and that's why parents should not let their kids play those types of games. just because it's a video game does not mean it is ok for kids to play. every game is not mario. it's just like cartoons, parents assume because it is a cartoon, it is ok for kids to watch. but it isn't. you have shows like the simpsons, which aren't really good for young kids to watch. then you have all that manga anime' porn stuff. it's a cartoon, but it's certainly not for kids.

9. what about wrestling? i don't hear anywhere near as many complaints about wrestling teaching kids to be violent. but i see little kids jumping off of things onto each other and punching and kicking all the time obviously trying to imitate their favorite wrestler. I don't blame wrestling for that though. the parents shouldn't let them watch wrestling if it causes them to do that. i wasn't allowed to watch it when i was a kid for that reason...

the bottom line is, parents just need to take a little responsibility and stop trying to spoil the fun of responsible grown-ups who can handle violent video games.

anyway. i've wasted enough time on this subject. i'm going to go buy a ps2 and gta iii blow some stuff up....