Photoshop - "Art" - and Web Design

everybody line up to spank mihai - he he

seriously j.k. ya gotta take comments with a grain of salt.... don't take things to personally

cheers
heathrowe

First, I don't think you should take mihai's reply as an insult at all. If that makes you want to leave a community, you won't be able to stay anywhere. Mihai's reply maybe seemed a tad harsh because we're all such pussies here and are too nice half of the time. :p

And I read your post (quickly), and people are right in this thread I think.
Also, to add something;

- The content is the star. It's the content that you should be thinking of instead of some effects. Sure, an effect can reflect the content in a "cool" way, but still.
Also, I think tutorials are the devil. I never used one to learn anything concerning photoshop. I'm no saying "I'm just that good" at all, just that I didn't have an internet connection at the time I started out. It's been a great thing, I'm sure. When you practice through tutorials, you'll always be thinking "how did I get that glowy stuff...oh yeah!", and then you create the same crap all over again. Well not really, but you get what I'm implying. Just hit me when you started listing out exact effects you know how to do thanks to tutorials.

And yes, being original and artistic can't be tought via tutorials. Actually, I'm pretty sure you can't learn it at all, if you haven't got it in you to start with...a bit, at least.
Drawing in photoshop and designing have not much in common. Drawing isn't design at all, and vica versa. And that reminds me, don't get a wacom in case you're not planning on going into digital painting (/drawing), a wacom is of no use concerning webdesign.

My 0.0004 cents would be, to pull the WWW plug and experiment. And also, force yourself to learn all important keyboard shortcuts. It's unbelievable how much they do for you, clicking with the mouse here and there and browsing menus and such is nothing but a waste of time.

Anyway, leaving for something like this isn't sensible. Leave if you want to, but try to thicken your internetskin a bit. :D

whoa

*sits spanked in a corner for a while then comes back to face the crowd...

ximensions - let me rant back at you a bit

It is because of posts like this that communities such as this deteriorate.

why? just because people speak their minds? albeit in a (ahem!) questionable manner? I think a community must be stronger than this - if an honest post starts deteriorating it...whew - it's bad....

Okay, you apologised, but that damage had already been done.

like...what damage? Have I stolen his allowance? Have I pushed him to suicidal? What? I didn't force gim to leave. If you have a mate at school who picks on you..do you change schools? Stand up damn it and fight for your rights like a man I say.

You have to understand, many people feel vulnerable when they are new to a community, especially when they are new to the common interest or skill that it shares, i.e. newbies.

Now why would I understand that? It's not like I was ever a newbie...Why when I first came here (not too long ago btw) I immediadely had Pank add 1000 posts to my name just to pick on sensitive guys. It's a known fact that I live just to feed on poor unfortunate souls - I have no other pleasure in life.

Another thing you must understand, new members are often not aware of certain etiquettes or rules, and may not have had the initiative to read the rules, simply because they are new to these communities.

So - I need to understand that even though it is plainly stated that new members should read the rules first - it's ok not to read them and uphold them? Why of course - I see ..wow - why didn't I think of that..hmmm...I really must have a heart of stone.

Seriously now - ^these^ are not for Bowman. They are for you.

Let me tell you a bit about me - since you chose me as your rant subject - I'll give you some details.

I am also new to this forum - Maybe not that new but new nevertheless. I try to help people who come here as best I know how. I also come here to look for comments and critique on my work as I really appreciate the oppinion of this community. I don't like all of the members but I like most of them as persons, some of them I love as artists and I absolutely grok them all as a whole. Bad and good. I have never before this post "picked" on anyone. well - not true - I did have a fight (?!) with zerimar but it was academic and I like him otherwise - we just have different views on religion.... I apologized to Bowman because I did come off a bit hard. I blame only me for this - it was late and at my age I should know better than to mix beer and votca. But that doesn't change anything. I wasn't exactly offensive. I just spoke my mind...and since it was started from the beginning as a rant...I just ranted back.
I strongly believe that this forum is more about photoshop and digital art than anything else. So it's those posts that weigh heaviest... the rest is just nice stuff. I made friends while here - and I do believe that if I were this ogre you're painting me - then - heck - all my friends are ogres too:D But I met them here.... soo - this must be an ogre friendly board:D

I value your input as oppinion but...it doesn't convince me. Maybe you are a best man than I am. There's two ways you could impress me. One way is to show me how damn good you are with art and design and..yes photoshop. The other way is to tell me something really worth knowing - you're only being goody-goody... not really useful and helpful.




There - I've done it again
If I deserve to be spanked....let he who is clean cast the first stone

*hopes Biblical refferece will soften people's hearts and pardon the vile offender

If I deserve to be spanked....let he who is clean cast the first stone

Me me!!



Had to. :D

Ahh - yes - yes! paavo - More please

ROFL I spurted coke all over my monitor - you sick finnish

Nother rant :D

You have to understand, many people feel vulnerable when they are new to a community, especially when they are new to the common interest or skill that it shares, i.e. newbies. Instead of getting on their high horse and automatically dissing people "can't you google?", "stupid, use the search tool" (not quoting anyone here), it would be more helpful if people were actually friendly

As much as the "use google" replies piss me off (when replied to other ppl, not myself), I understand the poster's side....because newbs these days dont do SH$T!!. Most never think for themselves, most dont know how to problem solve, most are extremely impatient, and most dont even experiment/try before they ask. They just want someones hand to hold through the proccess.

Like bowmans post ......

Here's the thing though. I bet I'm now at least 30 hours into doing Photoshop Tutorials now. No lie! And that's just counting the QuickTime Movie Lenth. That's not counting the amount of time I've spent moving back and forth between my copy of Photoshop CS - working on the image - and then going back to the Movie.

I've also gone through that excruciating initial process that I think comes with a lot of software of learning all the buttons and stuff like that. To which I'll add, gawd does Photoshop ever have a lot of them. And I'm glad for that, but still that's not my point.

In the process of doing all that I've learned a heck of a lot about photography - retouching photos - creating gel text - plastic text - crystals - orbs - gradients - etc.. I can create torn paper - attach a torn note to a photo and add to that a 3D paper clip. I can stick heads on other people's body's. Remove wrinkles. Heck, I can even make a brush out of my face. No lie!!! rofl.

But still - if I had to sit down and just create a graphic similar to the header graphic I referenced above I have to admit I'd be totally lost.

30 hours and some tuts arent going to make him an artist. It takes years to develop PS skills and creative skills. Now does he wonder how to fix this/improve and searches the net endlessly for weeks/months/years soaking up every little bit of info he possibly can, then starts reading books and praticing like the rest of us..........no. He rants..looking for a quick answer! Its like me asking you for the meaning of life.

There is no quick answer. It takes blood/sweat/tears and commitment, something newbs dont grasp for some reason. Also i need to point out....bowmans actions. He just up an left. Way to give up. Thats the problem with newbs. They cant handle things on there own / dont even try. Its either an easy answer....or the highway.


Why should we be friendly and understanding....if they're not ready to help themselves first? The reason we are not as friendly as we could be....is we dont know either. Its a question no one can answer for him. So this whole post could be avoided....its an annoyance issue really. Also alot of ppl (especially online) dont know how to properly phrase a question or get to the point. So it just adds fuel to the fire......

It is because of posts like this that communities such as this deteriorate

uhmmmm, NO. If its post like this that are ruining the community for you.....then your here for the wrong reasons. This community is as good as it gets. Go into the help sections and showcases and you'll see. Its not really about being friendly, and feelings, and welcoming ppl and all that bull. Its about sharing knowledge. The rest is a bonus.

Another thing you must understand, new members are often not aware of certain etiquettes or rules, and may not have had the initiative to read the rules, simply because they are new to these communities.

Seriously....read the F*n FAQ. There is no good excuse not too. Just cause they're new....dont mean sh*t. (which also ties in with newbs being lazy....)


Also quit complaining bout mihai's post already. A little harsh...possibly. Anything wrong with it...NO. And he even apologized....so enough said. And if bowman aint coming back........why we still having this discussion?? lol

- Fine for ppl to speak their minds, but there are certain ways to put things - do as you want, I was simply saying what I thought.

- Damage = you scared him away. I would have been fine if you had replied as you did to Bowman, since I'm not really new to all of this.

- Everyone was a newbie once, stop being an ass.

- I'm guilty of not reading the rules first as well, since I want to get stuck in, but I read the rules once a member has either politely asked me to, I've finally found some intelligence to or a member has flamed the hell out of me.

- I didn't mean to personally attack you, if it seemed that way I apologise, I was really talking in general.

hmmm...how do I impress you...I don't feel the need to.

However, I am working on my website, and it'll kick your ass!! j/k Have fun, and sorry for all the spanking.


--- okay okay, I'm going to shut the hell up about this, before I get spanked.

haha - no need to apologize to me

Post mockups of your site - let us bad, ugly people tell you about it:D

yes, check out the relevant section, you'll see my site posted there.

- oh yea also: btw, I don't think you're all bad - this forum (and thus the members) has helped me a lot - even with stupid questions!

The problem with new "artists" summarized:

People are taking the medium of digital art and making it the art itself. It's not about designing for so many people, it's about getting as many sh*tty effects as possible into a file to make it "cool." Treat photoshop like a piece of paper and a pen, don't have it do the work for you.

Yeah, I started out like all these newbies, I admit it. I just wanted to make something "cool," but I have changed. If you are stuck with photoshop and do not have the artistic spark I would suggest laying off the computer for a while and learning to draw. Go to a bookstore and look at some print design annuals.